Today, we have the pleasure of interviewing Paulina Lule. We see that you identify as a non-binary, genderfluid, pansexual actor, filmmaker, and conservationist.
You are a multifaceted person, and before we delve into your career, we’d like to understand how identifying as non-binary has influenced your acting career. In a broad sense, how do you perceive roles for non-binary actors? Are there many roles for non-binary actors in the film industry? How do you envision the industry’s approach to non-binary actors within the world of cinema? What do you anticipate for the future?
How has identifying as non-binary influenced my acting career? I would say coming out as non-binary has given me such clarity of my own self-image, that I feel so much more capable of bringing my full self to my work. In turn, this has given me a great deal of self-confidence which any actor will tell you, in a hard profession like ours, is a major key to sustained success. It’s like something clicked for me, and suddenly my work became so much more relaxed and I took a big leap forward.
For me, non-binary thinking the idea that everyone is a unique individual, and that one can exist outside the socialized gender norms and character traits that are used to label us Man or Woman. Growing up, I was always called a “tomboy” and told that it was a phase I would grow out of. As if whatever “boyish” character traits I exhibited as a child were only available to me for the duration of this phase, and I would have to give them up in order to become a Woman. But what if they were actually who I am? So you’re telling me there’s these boxes of character traits and social norms marked “Man” and “Woman,” and I am only allowed to select from one or the other? That makes no sense to me! For me, there are no boxes. All of these things can exist at any time in anyone and can change over time, and therefore we do not need to create these boxes of Man and Woman to fit them in. It sounds simple, but I think it’s very radical when you consider so much of our society is built on these boxes. So many of people have spent their lives inside these boxes and built their entire identites around them — I think that’s why I think there is so much backlash for gender non-conforming people in our country.
I say all this to say that I cannot speak for all non-binary people and their experiences in our industry, since I believe everyone is an individual with their own interpretation for what it means to them, but I do believe that if the industry embraced non-binary thinking when it comes to creating roles, casting them would become that much more equitable, and all gendered and non-gendered people alike would benefit. We would truly be casting based on who people are, rather than through the lens of socially constructed norms.
Are there many roles for non-binary actors in the film industry? I can’t really say. I do think you are starting to see more non-binary actors in major roles in general. You have Emma D’Arcy in the House of the Dragon, Bella Ramsey in The Last of Us, Amandla Stenberg in The Acolyte and others. And you are also starting to see characters who are written as non-binary in shows like Billions and Grey’s Anatomy. I think all of this representation is great to see. I think we need more of these types of roles so we can begin to expand what non-binary folks look like on screen to match the real world — in other words, we are not all thin, androgynous, AFAB, people with shaved heads. And I say this understanding the full irony of how I myself present ha!
- Let’s start with your acting career. Tell us about what attracted you to it and inspired you to pursue it.
I came to acting “late.” When I first started, I hadn’t come out as non-binary yet, and starting acting in your late 20s as a woman is considered “late.” The funny thing is, the desire has been there since I was a child. Growing up, I acted out all my favorite movies on my front lawn in Wisconsin. The Wizard of Oz, Red Sonja, The Labyrinth. You name it. I was always coming up with these wild role playing schemes (e.g. secret agents, elven warriors, etc), creating costumes and props out of construction paper and cardboard, and begging my friends to join me on an imaginary adventure. As I got older, my friends grew out of it, and in middle school I was bullied a lot, so I just put it all away. Since there weren’t many in my immediate life that did anything remotely like this, I had no one to see that interest as a child and guide me toward a career in film and television. Like many Midwesterners, I was pushed in a more practical direction. In college, I ended up becoming a computer engineer because I was good at math and science and convinced by others around me that it was a “stable career.” I worked as an engineer for a few years, all while secretly looking up film schools. So when I got laid off, I said stability be damned and began my journey to film school, which ultimately led me to taking acting classes as a way to understand directing better. Upon doing so, I reconnected with my love of acting out stories and the rest is history.
- You’re also a filmmaker. You made your debut with a 20-minute movie, “The Homecoming,” which won several awards. This was followed by three short films, crossing the genres of drama and thriller. How would you describe yourself as a director and what are your interests? Do you have any upcoming projects?
I would describe myself as someone who is interested in directing character-driven genre films. The Homecoming was a straight drama film about a young woman who returns home to Milwaukee from California to welcome her brother home from a long stint in prison, only to find that the rest of the family wants nothing to do with him. It’s a story that is very close to me personally, and I wrote it as a way to process my feelings about my own brother being in prison for an extended period of time. It was my thesis film while I was in graduate school at Chapman University in Orange County, California, and like most successful thesis films, the next step is usually to make a feature film version. I wracked my brain for months trying to figure out how to expand a 20 minute short film into a 90-minute feature and I just kept coming up against the fact that I had already told that story the way I wanted to tell it. I needed something fresh. As a lifetime fan of genre (The Matrix was the movie that made want to make movies), I decided to see what would happen if I added a genre twist to it. From that, my current project Sherman Park was born. It’s a story of Miles, who having recently been released from prison, returns to his neighborhood of Sherman Park (in Milwaukee) to start his life over, but finds his fresh start will be more difficult than expected because society has “turned” on him. It’s a zombie film allegory about recidivism; a film that shows how difficult it is for people re-entering society to start a new life and stay on the right side of the law when society is hell-bent on forcing them to do otherwise. With that, the fire was lit! This was a fresh take and a newish story, and I still got to exorcise my angst about my brother returning home from prison. I am currently putting together funds for a proof of concept short film of the feature with aims to shoot in September, and we will be launching the crowdfunding campaign in late July. You can follow along for updates on my Instagram @paulinnium and my website www.paulinnium.com
- In your career, we’ve noticed that you’ve starred in many suspense thrillers and action-packed television productions. This July, you’re set to play Kimmer Garland in MGM+’s new film, “Emperor of Ocean Park”, another thriller where your character is…a bit malevolent. Could you give us a sneak peek into the production and the movie? And perhaps share a little about your character? How did you feel on the set? Was it comfortable to play the role of Kimmer?
I think Kimmer might be perceived as malevolent to some, but I just think she is a woman who knows what she wants and is very focused on getting it! ha “Emperor of Ocean Park” follows Talcott Garland as he and his sister Mariah try to uncover what they believe to be a conspiracy behind the death of their father, The Judge, played by the wonderful Forest Whitaker. I play Kimmer Madison-Garland, the wife of Talcott Garland, and I am a powerful lawyer who is on the short list for nomination by the President of the United States to a seat on the federal circuit court. For Kimmer this is a huge deal! It is the first step toward fulfilling her dream to become a Supreme Court Justice where she feels she can do some good in this country. It just so happens that this amazing news come at a time when her husband’s larger-than-life father dies, so she has to balance the excitement and nerves of this major career milestone with supporting her husband in his grief. Talcott’s foray into consipracy-ville doesn’t help matters much as her image has to be squeaky clean for the vetting process. There is so much room for DRAMA.
Working on Emperor of Ocean Park was an incredible experience. Not only was the writing incredible and the crew top notch, but working with this cast! Have you seen the cast?! Forest Whitaker, Grantham Coleman, Tiffany Mack, Henry Simmons, Bryan Greenberg, Keith Powers, Jasmine Batchelor… These people are at the top of their game and I am so honored to have been able to work with them. We bonded so quickly, and it truly felt like working with family both on and off set. And the local cast? Chicago has some of the best actors we’ve seen on television and I cannot wait for this show to showcase them — Dyllan, Ora, Greg, Deanna, Kelli, Torrey, I mean… I could go on and on and on. I learned so much from each and every one of them and I’m so very excited for everyone to see the work we’ve done.
Was it comfortable playing the role of Kimmer? I don’t ever think playing any role is “comfortable” per se, but I do think the discomfort of exploring parts of myself that I keep hidden or reject or don’t often let people see are why I enjoy acting as a profession. Kimmer definitely has aspects of her personality that I do not share, but also many that I do. It was a wonderful exprience navigating the space between the two.
- Now, to help the audience get to know you better, we have a few questions:
- What is it like learning Japanese? (personal curiosity!)
I was a huge anime and video game nerd in high school and still am. I watched strictly Japanese language versions with English subtitles and my favorite shows are still Escaflowne, Earth Girl Arjuna, Naruto, and Macross Plus. So I had heard Japanese all the time for years when I started studying it in college, and I picked it up pretty quickly. I studied abroad and started dating someone in Japan who spoke ZERO English — that’s when I became fluent ha! I haven’t spoken in quite a while, so I’m a bit rusty, but have been watching a lot of Japanese language movies and shows like Godzilla Minus One, Shogun on FX, and Tokyo Vice on Max, so my listening skills are returning. My husband has been obsessed with the game Ghost of Tsushima and I’ve been watching him play that, too. I have plans to take an extended trip to Japan in the near future!
- Your favorite movie?
Ooooo, this is always a difficult question for me to answer. I usually lead with the movie that made me want to make movies – The Matrix. I wanted to BE Trinity. It was one of the first movies that had extensive behind the scenes footage included in its DVD special features, and when I got to see how they made things, that lit the filmmaking fire in me.
- The best shooting experience you’ve had?
These are tough questions! Okay, outside of the Emperor of Ocean Park love fest, I have to say it would be a tie between my experience working on the set of Love on Netflix and The Good Place on NBC. On Love, we had some of the best comedy actors in the game and getting to improv with them for four days was just so much fun! Ted Danson was an absolute sweetheart on The Good Place and working closely with William Jackson Harper who plays Chidi was an honor. I have admired his work for along time! I’m also so excited to see Manny killing it on The Acolyte! He was also such a wonderful person to work with on TGP.
- An actor or actress you’d love to work with?
I have a whole list! Tom Hardy, Emma D’Arcy, Pedro Pascal, Angela Bassett, Hiroyuki Sanada, Sho Kasamatsu, Ken Watanabe, Keke Palmer, Daniel Kaluuya, Carrie Ann Moss, Denzel Washington, Ana Sawai, Liza Colón-Zayas, Jon Bernthal, Zendaya, Florence Pugh, Lashana Lynch, John Boyega! I mean… I could keep going, but I’ll stop ha!
- A director you’d like to collaborate with?
Oh gosh, another list! Ha! Ryan Coogler, Gina Prince Bythewood, Jordan Peele, Denis Villenueve, Christopher McQuarrie, John Woo, Spike Lee, The Wachowski Sisters, James Mangold, Takashi Yamazaki, Christopher Nolan… I’ll stop!
- Your favorite food?
This one I can get extremely specific ha! My absolute favorite food is the tofu and vegetable khao soi at Pailin Thai Cuisine on Grammercy and Hollywood in Los Angeles. A close second is grilled hokke and daikon mixed with shoyu at any Japanese izakaya in Japan.
It’s been a pleasure, Paulina Lule, and we wish you all the best for your future endeavors.
